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 Discussion Forums
 Playing Guitar
 DADGAD (Page 2)
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| Author | Topic: DADGAD |
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bkg Member |
posted 03-22-2002 08:59 AM
   
epaul-- I see the open tuning as a "flotation device" for the intuition. At the start, you have to kind of let yourself float along with them, until the tonal qualities that come from the experience saturate your ear. I'd recommend trying many different open tunings-- let yourself "float" in them and see where it takes you. After that, you may decide it's worthwhile to apply some intellect to the tuning(s)-- so you can learn to "swim" along with the inuitive current you've created. The more time you spend in open tunings, the more you tend to bring in technique you might use in standard tuning. Alot of people who work in open tunings end up using just a few-- and many decide to inhabit only one open tuning. The result is, that the tuning they inhabit-- such as DADGAD-- becomes an effective alternate to the standard tuning. So, I guess I am saying, at the start, you don't need to just focus on dadgad if you don't want to. Go with the flow man :-) |
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majorminor Member |
posted 03-22-2002 09:31 AM
quote: EC - perfect!! Just what I was seeking. Thanks! MM |
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epaul Member |
posted 03-22-2002 09:46 AM
I'm guessing some of you guys have been in alternate tunnings for several years (I don't even know how long DADGAD has been in general use). I'm wondering: #1 What percent of your music is in an "alternate" tuning? #2 If you could see ten years in the future, do you see more of your music moving back to "standard" tuning? #3 In ten years, will the term, "standard" tuning disappear? #4 Are "alternate" tunings the province of the instrumentalist, while the "Folk singer" types will stay in standard (if they perform live and only have one guitar)? #5 If you had grown up with DADGAD and Orkney et.al., and you were exposed to "standard" tuning for the first time at a workshop this weekend, what do you think your reaction would be? Paul
[This message has been edited by epaul (edited 03-22-2002).] |
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Teja Gerken Moderator |
posted 03-22-2002 10:13 AM
epaul, Probably about 90% of what I do is in alternate tunings. I don't think "standard" tuning is about to disappear, if only for all the classical and jazz players that will never start to stray. As far as alternate tunings on the 12-string go, I use a lowered version of DADGAD almost exclusively. Other than on the six-string though, I'd never dream of actually retuning on stage, which I think would spell instant death... While I love Ralph Towner's 12-string work, I don't think that he uses alternate tunings other than drop-D, so he may not be the best example. I do think that Kottke uses open-D and open-G on the 12, as did many of the older blues guys. |
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Bill Hammond Member |
posted 03-22-2002 10:25 AM
Terrific questions, Paul. My responses: #1 What percent of your music is in an "alternate" tuning? (What I plan on putting on my next CD will be about 80 percent non-standard.) #2 If you could see ten years in the future, do you see more of your music moving back #5 If you had grown up with DADGAD and Orkney et.al., and you were exposed to [This message has been edited by Bill Hammond (edited 03-22-2002).] [This message has been edited by Bill Hammond (edited 03-22-2002).] |
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Matt Sarad Member |
posted 03-22-2002 10:46 AM
I play DADGAD on 90+ % of my originals and arrangements for fingerstyle. I flatpick and play electric in EADGBE/standard. It has been this way for the last 15 years, SO I guess the next ten will be no different. As for the last question, couldn't tell ya. |
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Dustbowlman unregistered |
posted 03-22-2002 11:11 AM
My two main tunings are "dropped d" and DADGAD. It's easy to move between the two, because it only requires tuning 2 strings. Once you become accustomed to dropped d, you can form most of the chords you are used to in standard tuning. Standard tuning isn't going away, by any means. But as guitarists, we are fortunate to be able to have a world of options available with tuning that, say, pianists, reed and brass players don't have access to. Plenty of singers accompany themselves in open tunings- from Libba Cotton to Joni Mitchell to Luca Bloom - all with their own styles. If I came upon standard tuning from out of the blue, I'd probably say, "what the ****?" |
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Teja Gerken Moderator |
posted 03-22-2002 11:20 AM
I should add that I do use standard tuning pretty much every time I play something from a chart, for jazz and classical stuff, as well as for general jamming with other players. It's just that I don't do much of any of these things at the moment, which increases my use of alternate tunings. |
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bkg Member |
posted 03-22-2002 11:35 AM
Teja-- There are indeed songs on Solo Concert that are in altered tuning for 12 string. He makes up songs occassionally on stage using tunings that are unfamiliar to him-- this is what he told us in any case. The 12 string songs on Solo Concert are apparently "never played the same way twice," on the tour where it was recorded. Epaul-- I originally used standard tuning as a point of reference only. I felt less intimidated by open tunings-- believing it was easier for me to express what I was hearing in those. Now, I am interested in doing things in a way that allow me to have the sensibility of altered tunings in standard tuning, and the sensibility of standard tuning in altered tuning. At a certain point, you develop a pallette to express yourself from-- and if you find yourself in any tuning it's gonna sound like "you." |
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LarryH unregistered |
posted 03-22-2002 11:36 AM
quote: Yes, one of his earliest sales. The story still gives me goose-bumps. Ironically, Asimov frequently expressed frustration that many fans would approach him praising that story, while he would rather have been remembered for his later (and presumably better) work. After all, he was a student (don't recall whether high school or college) when he sold "Nightfall." |
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tandrink unregistered |
posted 03-22-2002 11:43 AM
My apologies for the beginner-type question amongst this thread of experienced alternate tuning players, but there seems to be a consensus that jazz and classical do not use alternate tunings. I know from my study of the blues that standard tuning is usually the way to go unless playing bottleneck (which uses mainly open tunings, especially D and G). And most rock/pop music I've come across tends to use standard tuning as well. Also after taking a quick look at the DADGAD chart that EC so kindly linked too, the fingerings for "regular" chords (majors, minors and 7ths) seem to be pretty tricky. So I guess my question is, what the heck do you use these open tunings for (what type of music or sound are you after) and what exactly is the benefit? Again, my apologies if I've just sent this thread back to the Middle Ages. |
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Bill Hammond Member |
posted 03-22-2002 11:55 AM
quote: Short answer is that the benefit is NOT having regular chords, NOT having regular, common voicings, and having all these wonderful sympathetic unfingered strings ringing out as you plunder a melody line here, there and everywhere. I guess we'd be kidding ourselves if we didn't admit that taking the alternate-tuning plunge most likely leads one on the path to playing solo pieces rather than playing what is essentially vocal accompaniment, but then there are tons of folks like Martin Simpson and Richard Thompson and many, many others who masterfully combine the unique tonalities of alternate-tuned guitars with wonderful vocals and great songwriting. (In that sense, I would even hesitate to call it accompaniment -- it's more like a duet of guitar and voice when the guitar is so distinctive and sustainy...) So the advantage is that you are in another world, really. And you can conceive these wonderful, full-sounding, complete pieces with sounds and voicings you have just never heard before, and it's very energizing and inspirational. Yes, it can be hard to play an Eb major ninth in Orkney, but it's easy to play a glorious chord and melody combination that would be IMPOSSIBLE in standard tuning. Next time you see an accomplished open-tuning player in action, check out how little his/her hands are moving. It's almost like cheating sometimes, how easily the gorgeous sounds can be achieved. |
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rh2d unregistered |
posted 03-22-2002 11:58 AM
I second tandrink. I've been at the Mark Hansen site and it looks like I am going to have to learn a bunch of new fingerings for cords and maybe new finger patterns. Where is it going to get me? Is it a relearning process every time I retune? Don't want to go there. Roy |
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rh2d unregistered |
posted 03-22-2002 12:02 PM
Bill hadn't posted yet when I stuck mine up. Roy |
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epaul Member |
posted 03-22-2002 12:20 PM
Well, I'm going in, folks. I just put the SC12D in DADGAD, and I'll just leave it there for awhile. It really sounded strange at first, then I realized I had mis-spelled DADGAD. This will be interesting. Paul Larry, I read that story when I was a kid, but the thought of seeing the stars for the very first time has never left me. Over the years, I have kind of softened the social disruption element, and given the concept more of a Zen twist. Asimov would have been a great guy to share a few late night beers with. |
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